APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 19 June 2020, 16:42

- To the best of my knowledge, the following map fits all requirements to be approved: YES
- The following map contains no unfair hidden features: YES
- The following map contains nothing against the PB2 Code of Conduct: YES
- I have read and understand fully the Required Reading for posting a Map Approval Request: YES
- I have read and understand fully the Map Approval Rules: YES

[2]
- Map Name: Summit (MP)
- Map ID: yizhe-hillmp
- Link to Map Page: https://www.plazmaburst2.com/?s=9&a=&m=yizhe-hillmp
- Link to Map Demo: https://www.plazmaburst2.com/?s=2&map=yizhe-hillmp
[3]
- Give a brief description of the map: Stated in page description
- Why you think the map deserves to be approved: Hopefully it meets the requirements this time
- Any other comments: No
Last edited by yizhe on 27 June 2020, 01:58, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] Summit (MP)

Postby Build » 20 June 2020, 12:12

glowing edge
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] Summit (MP)

Postby yizhe » 20 June 2020, 13:16

background has already been overlap and there is a lamp with no flare placed in the middle, otherwise it would be very dark. How do i remove the glowing edge?
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] Summit (MP)

Postby Stryde » 20 June 2020, 14:32

Many people comment on glowing edge background but never give how to fix it:


First, make sure background overlaps with wall around it
Second, either use an e-mark with shadowmap_size and play around with the parameter value for smooth shadows OR add a light in the region close to the wall that is dark in the original map

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 6 July 2020, 13:28

27/06/2020
1. Shadow map sized have been changed and fixed glowing edges.
2. Background design has been changed.
3. Roof of the map has been removed.
4. The 2 mini pools of each team has been changed to acid. A player with max health will take 10 Seconds to die in these acids. Acids have been placed to prevent camping and cushioning fall damage from the hill.
5. Alien plasma pistol has been changed to alien rail shotgun, as the plasma pistol is too op.

04/07/2020
1.fixed a bug that players have complained about random slicing damage at the side of the hill.
2.fixed a bug on the side pushers at the ceiling

06/07/2020
1. added underground tunnels for both teams. This is to allow more spaces for spawns in DM so that Players will not cluster too much in a tight space, which in the past led to spray havoc.
2. Each underground tunnel contains one LEVEL 3 upgraded CO-1y RayGun. Based on previous map test, players seldom enter the water area and the water area was deemed too big. With the new update, water area has been shrunk and more accessible.
3. The middle blocks located near the middle entrance of the water has been reduced by 2 Grid squares, rendering those 2 spots less camping friendly.

Currently, map look like this:


Proposal:
It is unknown to me if slopes are allowed in PB2 MP map approvals. I did a version of a sloped hill in my test map: yizhe-ant. There, you can find the hill with slopes.



I have play tested yizhe-ant in mp and through my findings, the slope did not have a great impact to players FPS and ping. If allowed, I would like to add the slope feature into yizhe-hillmp as it looks alot smoother and easier to climb as compared to stairs. However, if there are any issues with the slope which causes it to be unapproval, yizhe-hillmp will stick to the stairs.

Map is ideal for COOP, but can also be played in DM and TDM in a much faster pace.
COOP: Teamwork is upmost paramount, as all players start of at the same level (height) and within the teams, determine who will grab that Sniper RQ at the top, who will gain higher ground at the summit, and who would skirmish underwater for that alien rail shotgun and C-01y Raygun.

DM: moderate paced gameplay for 2-4 players, fast gameplay for more than 5 players. This map will be a challenge for players that are not familiar with more than one class of weapons, for this map features the ability to use slot 2,3,4,5 and 9 under 4 types of terrain within the same map: Open space, tight vertical space, water and tunnel.
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby Stryde » 6 July 2020, 13:48

yizhe wrote:Proposal:
It is unknown to me if slopes are allowed in PB2 MP map approvals. I did a version of a sloped hill in my test map: yizhe-ant. There, you can find the hill with slopes.


I have play tested yizhe-ant in mp and through my findings, the slope did not have a great impact to players FPS and ping. If allowed, I would like to add the slope feature into yizhe-hillmp as it looks alot smoother and easier to climb as compared to stairs. However, if there are any issues with the slope which causes it to be unapproval, yizhe-hillmp will stick to the stairs.

I just went to playtest this in SP and my screen is also visually tearing whenever I'm near the slopes due to the massive amount of objects centered in one area of the screen, so I would say that this is not advisable. Even your first version, hillmp, is laggy to me and may require some optimization, but with slopes, it's more noticeable to me.

Slopes are unique but contribute a huge number of objects to the map loading time, even if it doesn't feel like it is affecting yizhe-ant. Your map and proposal, hillmp, have probably the same amount of objects that make up the slopes in yizhe-an which means if you were to make these changes in hillmp, the number of objects would double and increase lag for other users.

Theres a chance this map may still have less objects than other approved maps, but walls contribute more than backgrounds in lag perhaps, or maybe because there are large number of objects concentrated in one area, this also contributes to more lag.

To me though, I'm unsure if hillmp would play different or feel different from some other similar approved maps in terms of gameplay design, but that's what testing is helpful with:
https://www.plazmaburst2.com/?s=9&a=&m= ... &id=542737
https://www.plazmaburst2.com/?s=9&a=&m= ... &id=438644
https://www.plazmaburst2.com/?s=9&a=&m= ... &id=845685 (this one in terms of lane design)

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 7 July 2020, 05:24

The map that is lining up for approval is yizhe-hillmp, the one without slopes. Unfortunately, the hill cannot be negated nor for it to have its walls reduced due to the requirement of overlapping of walls. Object count wise, the number of walls falls within most approved map range when i did a comparison with approved maps with open sources.

I do appreciate your feedback on the slopes, which i had previously failed to flag out. Thus the slope will not be added to the map yizhe-hillmp to prevent lags so that this map can be played in most computer.

Also, thank you for pointing out 3 maps that shared similar gameplay or looks. I had never noticed those maps before, glad that you brought those to my attention. My map does share some similarities with the second map in terms of hill gameplay, but in my opinion, not with the first and third. This map does feature a hill similar to the second map, as well as the open space on higher elements. Every map is unique, and i find my map unique as it incorporates both open space and CQB in one map, alongside with water and tunnel terrains. All 3 grenades will come in very handy ;)

The difference between my map and the map made by xd is that in my map, side towers are almost on par with the height of the summit so that the summit would not be a death trap as it is an open space. Furthermore, having the summit as the highest point and making it open air does make players feel like they are at the pinnacle, u think so too? XD

Just to add on some description, the weapons are specially picked for the reasons:
OEDA rifle: burst rifle, a rifle that is well balanced as it doesnt spam, and it looks nice!
Needle: 2 hits to the head and u r dead, but low firing rate as compared to the rifle. Excellent for mid range if you can aim well :)
Rocket cs lit bro: flush out ur enemies, but careful, dont blow ur allies up!

Team weapons:
Sniper RQ: a weapon for sharpshooters! Thx for the training stryde!
Alien rail shotgun: located in the water, and rail projectile travel faster in water as compared to bullets, encouraging players to go underwater too! In close combat, deadly weapon if u know how to use it right
C-01y raygun: located in the tunnel to encourage players to fight underwater too. Oh did i say shotgun was deadly?
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby Nyove » 7 July 2020, 18:18

Some points we would like to point out

- Glowing edges BG
- Pickaxe in the mid looks weird for approval gameplay
- Hill should be revamped
- Acid lakes make movement worse due to its placement
- Flat middle ground
- Water needs to be buried (floating water? I also generally are against huge water areas for approved map
- Poor wall structure at the side

CH55: I can't get the map's concept, it feels like mix of many maps, but without main idea.
Proud to be part of something meaningful.
Need any assistance? Join the PB2 discord server at https://discord.com/invite/Bhe9rNz or raise a support ticket at https://www.plazmaburst2.com/support

Contact me on discord for quickest reply possible.

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 14 July 2020, 10:24

10/07/2020 update:

Massive revamp to the map

1.Side structure has been changed

example:

Old models


VS

New models



2. Hill has been revamped

Old model



VS

new model



3. underground water has been completely refurbished, with water significantly reduced to act as puddles.

4. the old acids pools have been moved to the underground portion instead.

5.Gravitators have been reduced from 4 to 3

6. windows have been removed.

7. All players HP has been increased from 150 to 200, due to factor of having rockets in the map.

8. did adjustments to the BG to look more aesthetically appealing

9. A gravitator has been added to the lower middle portion.

currently, map looks like this:




14/07/2020 Updates:

1. added lasers to the end of the maps



2. adjusted water level height by 20px
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby haidar9036 » 15 July 2020, 14:52

This map is pretty darn good, would recommend approval

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 16 July 2020, 06:53

Thank you! <3
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby kubakuba » 16 July 2020, 08:18

1. Bad water cover https://prnt.sc/tir34x\
2. This wall is not needed https://prnt.sc/tir467
3. Use only one type of grass https://prnt.sc/tir4wu
4. Glowing walls https://prnt.sc/tir629
5. Maybe add here wall https://prnt.sc/tir7m5
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 16 July 2020, 13:33

Thank you for the playtest :D

16/07/2020:

1. water and acid has overlapped all walls.

2. wall removed.

3. Grass standardised to all bright green grass

4. BG has overlapped walls.

Under the guidance by CH55, the following adjustments have been made:

1. map has been re-aligned to symmetry, rectified from a previous fault.

2. the top of the map (peak of the hill) shall remain as it is. (sorry kubakuba)

3. The ROCKET LAUNCHER CS-LITBRO has been removed from individual players, instead, it would replace the former position of the team guns: Alien rail shotgun

(do drop me a pm if you guys have thoughts on this)

4. push areas for gravitators have been reduced to suit the surface area better

5. push areas have been re-adjusted from y -0.33 to y -0.4

6. An invisible door of 10px (excluding overlap) has been added to each AG
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby kubakuba » 16 July 2020, 15:49

Bad water overlamp https://prnt.sc/tj16x0
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby Stryde » 17 July 2020, 02:33

yizhe-hillmp (most recent playtest)
- Why even include this area of the map that isn't possible to access? https://prnt.sc/tfcjhq Can you spawn in this area in TDM or DM?
- Lack of cover for players (Nyove addressed this in previous feedback) https://prnt.sc/tfcom7
- Water and acid are too shallow here. Acid feels weird to gameplay since it is so small. Water also has two distinct layers and poor wall overlapping that doesn't look good https://prnt.sc/tfck30 - Nyove pointed all of this out from your last playtest and you still have not fixed this
- If map is red vs blue, why does red team have yellow arrows but blue team has red/orange arrows? https://prnt.sc/tj70c5 https://prnt.sc/tj707o
- Gravitators should be stronger for players to easily move between platforms in them while holding a weapon
- Map endpoints are too strong. Do not use value 20 on any pusher to define edge of map. Use X value of plus or minus 1 and stability damage of 100.
- Gameplay trigger actions must be removed from map. Ranked and unranked have different underlying mechanics and using gameplay triggers affects those underlying mechanics, making your map different than others.
Now, map feels like its background-designed from Ditzy and kubakuba and doesn't feel unique by appearance.

Much of this was feedback from your previous playtests because you have not changed your map in a way that supports the map being approved. These changes must be considered if you are still attempting to gain approval on this map, otherwise, there will be no further playtesting.

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 17 July 2020, 12:20

Hi Stryde! Thank you for playtesting my map! I got a question to clarify tho.

You did mention about: - Gameplay trigger actions must be removed from map. Ranked and unranked have different underlying mechanics and using gameplay triggers affects those underlying mechanics, making your map different than others.

This is in line with the current map approval rule, however, in the advanced level editor, i found another set of rules:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GT_bm2 ... M7RME/view

CTRL+F:
194
211
214
216

I am somewhat confused whether to add gameplay triggers or not. I request your professional knowledge to clarify my confusion. Thank you!

Also, to answer your first question, no one can spawn in the area. A brief background as to how i came up with this: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GT_bm2 ... M7RME/view

Back when i first published this map, the old hill was just rock material and the middle is just black (refer to my OLD version of the hill that i posted above, but when it first started out it didnt have a picture) . Many players feedback saying that the black area of old hill was too plain and ugly, so i decided to add a pixel picture. However, i learnt from nyvove that pixel pictures are unlikely to be approved. Thus i revamp the hill and thought that having a "cave in the hill" was unique.

However, if this concept isnt well liked, i will change it back to black hill.

map is currently still updating with accordance to your's and nyvove comments.
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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby Stryde » 17 July 2020, 13:15

yizhe wrote:Hi Stryde! Thank you for playtesting my map! I got a question to clarify tho.

You did mention about: - Gameplay trigger actions must be removed from map. Ranked and unranked have different underlying mechanics and using gameplay triggers affects those underlying mechanics, making your map different than others.

This is in line with the current map approval rule, however, in the advanced level editor, i found another set of rules:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GT_bm2 ... M7RME/view

CTRL+F:
194
211
214
216

I am somewhat confused whether to add gameplay triggers or not. I request your professional knowledge to clarify my confusion. Thank you!

This advanced level editor is not endorsed or affiliated with the more recently updated approval guide that Kiriakos and I wrote. Ranked vs unranked for approved maps have different multipliers for things such as regeneration rate, respawn rate, and your map has gameplay triggers that change the way these parameters are affected (to mimic ranked), but it cannot mimic unranked gameplay if there are gameplay triggers to mimic ranked gameplay. I personally wasn't aware that ranked and unranked have different attributes but this is what Kiri and Tempus told me when the map was playtested.
Last edited by Stryde on 21 July 2020, 14:54, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 18 July 2020, 14:52

18/07/2020 updates:

1. removed the unplayable cave portion out of the hill.

2.acid has been removed

3. water has been overlapped.

4. gravitator pusher has been increased from y -0.4 to y -0.5

5.map endpoints pusher x value has been reduced to 1 and -1 with 100 stability damage

6. gameplay trigger removed

7. background revamped.

8. 2 doors has been added to tunnels.

9. vortex has replaced rocket launcher CS-LITE BRO and every player gets a vortex. alien rail shotgun has returned and each team gets one.

11.there was an issue of player camping at the side of the hill.

https://imgur.com/a/3mo61oB

so i created a new point of attack, increasing the point of attack from 2 to 3, rendering the spot to be a bad camping spot.

https://imgur.com/a/IlsyG47

12. shield nades have been removed

13.port nade reduced from 3 to 2

14. structure at the sides of the map have been optimised and elevated to enable smooth movement with swords

15.did changes to the mid to prevent spam fire

currently, map looks like this:

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby Stryde » 21 July 2020, 15:03

yizhe-hillmp (most recent playtest)
Your line of sight problems
- Map seems to still have too many lines of sight, this has not been addressed well for these areas after several playtests:
Middle of map is too open and can be sprayed in https://prnt.sc/tljfkj (see screenshot tly5ix for more line of sight issues from map preview page)
Top of map is too open and can be sprayed in https://prnt.sc/tljgiq (see screenshot tly5ix for more line of sight issues from map preview page)
When you add doors but do not change wall style, you can just sit in door, prevent automatic doors from closing, and have access to the old line of sight that was broken up by the door. You did not solve this issue by just adding doors https://prnt.sc/tlxy06
Doors can be used in assistance to help with this, but wall heights must be adjusted to provide cover regardless if doors are opened or closed in any area of map
- You must reduce number of lines of sight, still present in map https://prnt.sc/tly5ix
Since you are using very accurate weapons such as the needle and the vortex, you must re-work wall placements in addition to using doors. Change wall placements, add better natural cover to your map to let players feel safe. If you want to see instances of this, try playing Stryde-underground in singleplayer, a map that utilizes wall placements to break up lines of sights in combination with automatic doors.

Wall textures
The three additional walls are unneeded here, but if its for aesthetics, go for it I guess https://prnt.sc/tljg9c
Difference in wall textures doesn't look good https://prnt.sc/tlxw80

Gameplay mechanics
In such a big map why are spawns for a 6v6 stacked right on top of each other? This is terrible in COOP mode when player collisions are possible between players on same team because it slows everyone down from leaving spawn region
Alien rail shotgun does not many any sense as a weapon choice for this map when looking at other weapon choices.

These must be addressed in your next playtest, otherwise this map will no longer be playtested.

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Re: APPROVAL REQUEST] yizhe-hillmp

Postby yizhe » 25 July 2020, 14:50

25/07/2020 updates:

1.Middle of map has been changed to fix line of sight problem



2. summit of hill and top of map has been changed to fix line of sight problem





3. sides of hill has been changed to fix line of sight problem



4.bottom tunnel doors and walls have been readjusted and redone to fix line of sight problem.



5.
Stryde wrote:Wall textures
The three additional walls are unneeded here, but if its for aesthetics, go for it I guess https://prnt.sc/tljg9c


These walls were not originally designed for aesthetics. The longest wall was to break the line of sight from the side of the hill to the spawn. However, a lone wall itself is not appealing to the eye, thus i made a pattern design using walls.

6. Alien rail shotgun/android shotgun has been removed upon request.

7. players have been spread out.

8. now the hill is entirely grass.

9.Gravitators push have been changed from y-0.5 to y-0.45

there are some other slight changes around the map, based on the advice given by you and kubakuba.

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