New Weapons Demo Feedback

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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby mapsman5000 » 3 February 2018, 22:39

Oh HELL yes! After all this time of nothing new for PB2, and all of a sudden we get this?! Major props to Eric for not letting PB2 get stale while he works on PB2.5!
All the new skins are phenomenal honestly, but I'm also really loving the guns! For some reason, the RPG and the Usurpation Heater Rifles are standing out for me, but frankly I don't think there's any guns that are just bad in any way.
As for the new background decorations, those look pretty cool too!

Overall, I'm absolutely LOVING how this update is looking, and really looking forward to seeing how the community makes use of all the new stuff!

Edit: I take it all back... Needle is my new fav :D
Last edited by mapsman5000 on 4 February 2018, 19:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Hikarikaze » 4 February 2018, 00:04

I'm not too impressed by the weapon lineup. The character lineup on the other hand is nice except for a few skins that I personally can't bring myself to like.

Weapons
Falkok shotgun - Too generic of a weapon. The recoil is minimal which might be a plus but the spread is too much to allow this weapon to shine outside of CQC range so that doesn't really matter. This is more like a faster CS-DAZ/C-01s hybrid. For a shotgun though, the weapon sound doesn't really fit either. Shotguns are supposed to be powerful and the sound doesn't really suggest that. The holstering is weird (and the only thing I like) too considering it's holstered at the side like a handgun when it should really be at the back considering it's a rifle sized weapon. The damage output is a little bit ridiculous. For close ranges, it's close to perfect though at longer ranges, this weapon may be rather frustrating to challenge against.

Falkok rifle - It's basically a reskinned C-01r so it's not particularly interesting. Its accuracy is solid which makes the weapon decent for mid-range combat and maybe long range combat for a little bit before the spread really kicks in, but there's no reason to pick this over the C-01r given its strikingly similar performance. Even the firing sound is the exact same. There really isn't a slow firing rifle in the game so this could be perfect to start that weapon archetype with. The Alien Rifle game-wise might be a rifle that shoots slow but it's more for a marksman role. Have this rifle feature a 25% slower fire rate and increase the accuracy to make the weapon more suitable for long range while also making spread minimal. The damage output is also a bit lacking so a slight increase should put the weapon in a decent and comfortable spot, especially as a mid-range weapon.

Falkok pistol - I don't know if these weapons were meant to be the same as the C9 weapons, but this one is way too much like the C-01p. The damage output on headshots is wild and great but the damage done anywhere else is laughable, especially when using this at close range. I'm not sure how to criticize this one when it's essentially just the C-01p.

CP-Assault Rifle - I probably assume that acronym means "civil protector" considering it looks like it belongs with the skin. This rifle suffers from the same exact problem as the Falkok rifle. It's too similar to the C-01r. Currently, all three weapons are within the same archetype: fast firing, accurate, and meant for mid-range combat. The same suggestions I had for the Falkok rifle can also be applied here.

Gauss rifle - It's a fun weapon but it sounds so underwhelming. For a powerful weapon, I expect it to sound powerful too. The damage output is strong but it's similar to the Heavy Railgun. Option wise, I can't find any reason why anyone would choose one over the other.

Minigun LMG-01m - I don't see how it's a minigun. To me it's basically a compressed version of the C-02m and nothing more. I think I would like this weapon better if it used the CS-RC firing sound considering it's more of a LMG. It should sound like one at least. The design is rather realistic enough to a point where the CS-RC sound would fit in along with the weapon design without any issues.

PHANX 92 - It's perfect. It's essentially what I want the Falkok rifle and CP-Assault Rifle to be. The accuracy is nice and the weapon excels at mid-long range without trouble. Sadly it's the only rifle of its kind but it does offer variety which is what this game needs in terms of weapon performance, not aesthetics. The design is also nice too; it's like a slower firing counterpart to the CS-RC.

Usurpation sniper rifle - Can anyone even call this a gun? It's ridiculously ugly. Imagine the lower half of a F2000 stretched out horizontally with a massive barrel thrown on top of it. That's this gun. I won't even talk about how the gun not only fails to match the Usurpation color palette, but also fails to stick with the design style. The bullet also moves too slow for a sniper rifle. For a weapon that, by default, is and should be meant for long range, this gun fails to meet that purpose. The CS sniper rifle that we have is far better, performance wise and utility wise. The Usurpation sniper rifle's laser is non-existent when put on the Usurpation BG plus the fact there's no indication that the rifle is actually aiming at an enemy like the CS counterpart basically makes this weapon useless. Even if you do manage to find an enemy, the projectile speed is too slow for the weapon to do any justice with. The damage output is the only beacon of light for the gun.

AV-135 - It's certainly different in terms of firing sound. The gun feels like a direct competitor to the CS-RC which is fairly nice. The accuracy puts the gun more towards a CQC type of role which is unique among the rifle class. I'm sure mid range combat is possible with this gun but pulling that off with the current stats is going to be challenging which could encourage and hopefully force some sort of skillful player input at longer ranges.

Needle - The fact it's suppressed yet sounds unsuppressed is amusing. The way the weapon performs makes it stand out immediately from the rest of the sniper rifle class. It's more of a blend between the Alien Rifle and the CS sniper rifle but it feels like more of a competitor and counterpart to the Alien Rifle rather than the other sniper rifles.

RPG - It's basically just that one generic RPG that every shooter game has for the sake of having one. To me, it's a reskin of the current rocket launcher that's only in the game to satisfy the "modern era" style enthusiasts.

RMK-36 - The way it performs suggests it belongs more in slot 2. Putting it in slot 8 was definitely a missed opportunity to have a truly unique rifle-class weapon in slot 2. The way bullets disappear abruptly with no impact effect however is disappointing though. The damage output is actually pretty impressive. It's a great weapon for bringing down multiple people in succession and it does well in mid-range. The slower projectile speed is a good balance to the damage output in my opinion. Currently, the RMK's in a solid place.

QCcV-50 - I think the name should be shortened to the model name or the nickname. The RoF makes the gun a monster at CQC which automatically makes it a direct competitor to the Ray Rifle, so it's nice in that regard.

Alien laser rifles - Automatically unique. It brings variety to the current weapon set. The damage output is a bit too weak considering it takes a while for it to kill one person. The only utility use I can see this gun having is dealing damage across long distances instantly and simply stopping health regeneration by just damaging targets. The blue railgun impact effect is rather out of place considering the beam is red and the effect is blue. It should be red or the beam should be colored blue to match.

CR-45 - It's like the PHANX so I can't really complain too much. It seems solid across large distances. However, the blue bullets are out of place. I'd suggest switching them to regular yellow colored tracers to better fit the weapon's modernized aesthetic and even its tan color scheme.

SMG - I'm disappointed that this gun gets the most generic name out of the others. Surely better names exist for this. It's identical to the QCcV so anything I said there applies here as well. Design wise, I prefer this over its counterpart.

Energy Rifle - Another generically named weapon. It behaves too similarly to the Lite Railgun and feels like a more useless version. It's missing the things that make the Lite Railgun great such as instant projectile speed outside of water. I don't see a reason to prefer this over its counterparts especially when the pros for this weapon aren't as compelling or expansive as the Lite Railgun's pros

(spoiler has opinions on skins - unrelated)
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Characters
Raven series - I personally like the android color scheme more than the RvB versions. It's a good addition overall but my only gripe is the helmet design. It looks like someone took a bite off the back which is something that can't really be unseen.

Reakhosha Operative - Unless PB2 magically explains the existence of this skin lore wise, this looks out of place, especially since it's not a human faction either.

Civil Protector - It's certainly nice to see a militaristic skin that's not CS. Personally though, I think it's too bland. Some glowing accents would do wonders for the skin and make it look better personally.

Android ATM-105 - It reminds me of Raze but the color scheme doesn't particularly say "android" to me. Either way, it's nice that android/robotic characters are getting some attention.

Falkok Boss - I wish it had a better name. Its design screams mecha, particularly Gurren Lagann. It's a personal favorite for me and it actually doesn't look ugly like the other Falkok units (except for the Phoenix Falkok but its colors are what makes that one ugly).
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Roxxar » 4 February 2018, 01:17

hello, creator of falkok guns here

i'm not entirely satisfied with how they play right now. at the moment, they kinda just seem like Pistol C-01p/Rifle C-01r/Shotgun C-01s/CS-Sniper copies. at the same time, i didn't really want them to have the same bullet and sounds, but i guess i didnt specify that myself to begin with

i would like the pistol to be slightly slower, but a tad stronger. i intended it to be a sort of magnum pistol, which pb2 lacks at the moment.

i would like the rifle (which i initially intended to be a shotgun, but thats okay) to fire in bursts or in slow multishot (like the alien shotgun).

i would like the shotgun (which i initially intended to be a sort of plasma/grenade launcher) to be a plasma/grenade launcher, because thats how i intended it to be. a plasma/grenade launcher.

i'm kind of okay with the DMR as it is, i would just like for the model to be slightly larger and to fire a little bit faster while being a little bit weaker. it's not exactly a sniper rifle, but a DMR (reference: Halo 4 sniper rifle vs DMR)
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Re: My Opinion On Pb2's Feb 2 Update

Postby tehswordninja » 4 February 2018, 04:22

Sasage, merged your post with this topic for obvious reasons.

Overall my feedback from the original post hasn't changed much. Most of the weapons aren't held quite well, name changes should be put into play, and a rework of all or most of the stats of the weapons to make them more unique from one another. A few new sounds couldn't hurt, either.
who needs a PB2.5 release date, anyways?
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby wreak » 4 February 2018, 05:11

Where is the naked proxy skin?

But in all honesty I love the update, a whole bunch of map makers are going to add these guns into their maps so that way they get all the rates.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Fish 20 » 4 February 2018, 06:17

wreak wrote:Where is the naked proxy skin?

BOI

On Topic: IMO, I'm very excited for the new skins (especially dat Falkok Boss and the FTTP soldiers)
The weapons themselves could use a bit of editing (Falkok Shotgun on leg lol) but overall, me likey. :D :D :D
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Eric Gurt » 4 February 2018, 14:37

Did some updates.

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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Moonhawk » 4 February 2018, 14:41

Eric Gurt wrote:Did some updates.

the needle's new sound sounds like a duck or a swan or something. doesnt sound like a gun, let alone a silenced one

EDIT

also if the gun's silenced, it would be better to remove the muzzle flash or make it only slightly noticable

EDIT 2

finally
Last edited by Moonhawk on 4 February 2018, 15:40, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Alien security heavy » 4 February 2018, 15:03

The falkonian weaponry seems fine. There's a triple grenade launcher, a burst fire shotgun and pistol and marksman rifles got changed... to a good way IMO.
Minigun LMG got different sound... Which is okay.
Usurpation sniper feels good now. Shooting rails makes it different than CS Sniper.
Needle now has supressed sound. Good.
RMK-36 shoots mini BNG's. Glad that green bullet was a placeholder since of the gun's behaviour.
CP-rifle is now a mix of C-01r's firerate and CS-RC's accuracy. I think it's good middle ground.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Civil security lite 12054 » 4 February 2018, 15:23

Hoping there will be new vehicles soon. Maybe a flying helicopter ?
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Resi » 4 February 2018, 15:29

Ok the update fixed all of the guns IMO, just the lamp decor should fit the actual light with flare's size, maybe the IED/cells that didn't get added due to limited barrel code could be added as "vehicles" instead, you know like crates, just make them explode.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby unknown 1 » 4 February 2018, 16:02

The changes really fix a lot of problems, like making a lot of guns more unique, making some underpowered guns good or even great, changing some gun skins entirely. But the usurpation sniper rifle should be a darker shade of yellow, to match the other usurpation guns and characters. And the minigun, smg are still held weirdly.

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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Max teabag » 4 February 2018, 16:15

Awesome update... and thx for the categories... the guns are sweet now, but the automatic bng gun has an overwhelming sund and still like to see a "search" function for triggers xD
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Stryde » 4 February 2018, 16:22

Falkok guns need their title to be updated
I'm pretty sure the launcher reads as the shotgun and the assault rifle should be renamed to the shotgun

I still feel there was an overwhelming amount of slot 2 guns added, and the easiest to remove from slot 2 and switch to another slot, like slot 8, would be the alien laser rifles because they also have no penetration value (closer to slot 8 weapons than slot 2 weapons). Would also balance out the upcoming update

The usurpation sniper rifle didn't really have its issue fixed, in that its still just as big as before. The color isn't accurate now either, and it's more bulkier (bigger than the character model). Also, does it have 2 projectiles, because I saw it once penetrate a wall and didn't the next time?

The needle is still seems broken to me
The needle is a workup on the sniper rifle and is still 1 shot to die, but has higher rate of fire over sniper rifle and can still penetrate 4 pixel walls just like sniper rifle. Either penetration should be reduced to compensate to say 2 pixel walls, or damage/rate of fire brought down by a lot. It will end in same fate of lite/heavy railguns, where the lite railgun is nearly always prefered over what would be a more efficient firing gun

The RMK is also broken and much worse than BNG. It doesn't have nearly as high damage, but it feels more accurate and has an extremely high rate of fire, causing it to be easily spammed, and much worse than BNG. Instead of decreasing the rate of fire, maybe decrease the damage done and make it near a plasmagun in terms of damage, as a suggestion?
Last edited by Stryde on 4 February 2018, 18:09, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby tehswordninja » 4 February 2018, 16:27

The changes to the weapons were certainly all good.

The CP-Assault Rifle now has a much better feel to it.

The RPG, while still in need of a better name (something like RPG-94 would work fine), is a lot more different from the CS-LitBro now. Slower fire rate, more damage and accuracy. I like it.

The Smgs feel a bit more toned down, and are much more inaccurate. I don't mind this.

The RMK feels a lot nicer as well. It's kinda overpowered now, though. Damage needs to be toned back slightly.

Now that the vehicle gun actually works, it doesn't look that bad on the Mobile, but I doubt it'd look very nice on other vehicles. Still, variety is variety.

The "Minigun" C-01m still feels like a copy of the actual Minigun, but with a different sound it distances itself a bit more. I still think the weapon needs a name change, something like Machine Gun C-01m would be easily enough. I also wonder if using its current sound, but modified to be a bit more deeper would work?

I do feel like the Needle's sound could be improved, but it is much better than before. EDIT: The needle completely stomps in lower health maps. Damage may need to be tweaked.

The Alien Sniper Rifle is pretty awesome now. I think its color is also slightly off from the Alien Rifle and the Alien Laser Rifle, but it's not that much of an issue.

Some further changes: The AV-135 could do a bit more damage, but be a bit more inaccurate. Give it that real heavy hitting damage for that heavy sound.

The laser rifles still should be placed in slot 8, and be renamed to simply Alien Laser Rifle and Advanced Laser Rifle. Otherwise, the cooldown was definitely a good idea. Major props on that one, I didn't even think that was possible tbh.

The Energy rifle still feels a bit out of place. Perhaps giving it two projectiles would help? I also think it could honestly work as a Usurpation weapon with a simple color change.

The Gauss Rifle still needs a better name, but I think otherwise it is in a good place. Something related to the Civil Security, as it's obviously a Civil Security design. I've noticed the reload is a bit longer (that could just be me though), it seems to fit its reloading animation better.
who needs a PB2.5 release date, anyways?
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby lostmydollar » 4 February 2018, 16:32

Stryde wrote:The needle is a workup on the sniper rifle and is still 1 shot to die, but has higher rate of fire over sniper rifle and can still penetrate 4 pixel walls just like sniper rifle. Either penetration should be reduced to compensate to say 2 pixel walls, or damage/rate of fire brought down

tehswordninja wrote:The needle completely stomps in lower health maps. Damage may need to be tweaked.

alien rifle has the same damage, fire rate and penetration factor but no one complains about it

tehswordninja wrote:The AV-135 could do a bit more damage, but be a bit more inaccurate. Give it that real heavy hitting damage for that heavy sound.

no one likes inaccurate weapons
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby DoomWrath » 4 February 2018, 16:58

To those discussing balance and damage - have you considered that perhaps it's fine to leave certain weapons weak and certain weapons powerful?

In my opinion making everything "balanced" may have the negative impact of just making all the guns handle too similarly. If a gun is powerful, just don't use it in your map, or change other aspects of the map such as HP, or only give the gun to characters sparingly.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Zufix » 4 February 2018, 17:49

All the guns are good in the new demo update. Would be nice to have a Falkonian assault rifle but that's only just my opinion. The new Usurpation sniper sometimes shoots fine, but sometimes it kills you when you shoot it.
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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby gani » 4 February 2018, 19:03

My rating:
That new minigun should renamed as machine gun, btw it looks like mg-42
8 of 10
New alien sniper rifle, good job.
10 of 10
That little bastard is ugly, not pb2 style, very fast, old sounds
2 of 10
Falkok weaponry perfectly replaces red guns
10 of 10
Rpg should bit follow mouse cursor
9 of 10
Avr-135 its chinese ak-74 with unused minigun sunds.
9 of 10
Needle - pb2 styled Dragunov
9 of 10
Laser rifles well designed, but glitch when ping is high.
6 of 10
Cp Assault rifle is cool, similiar to default rifle but with new sounds, cp skin also cool
10 of 10
Cs autocannon is good alternative to default vehicle cannon, but color is not.
8 of 10

And now guns that don't have any special:
Energy rifle 8 / 10
Phanx-92 7 / 10
RMK-36 6 / 10
CR-45 6 / 10
Gauss rifle 6 / 10
Smg 5 / 10

Guns that should not be in game:
Cr-45 (no pb2 style, nothing new except skin)
Little bastard (no pb2 style, worse smg, ugly name)
Laser rifles (don't fits in approved maps, don't working on high ping)

Bonus:
CS-Oicw good rifle, shoot a burst of 3 bullets, oicw exist in real life and used in beta version of half life 2 and in other games, but it has bad accuracy and low texture.
8 of 10

I made map for 1.28 ID: gani-war
Last edited by gani on 4 February 2018, 19:31, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: New Weapons Demo Feedback

Postby Moonhawk » 4 February 2018, 19:10

gani wrote:maybe add cooldown?

maybe test it properly? pretty sure that it already has a cooldown.
gani wrote:That little bastard is ugly, not pb2 style, very fast, old sounds 2 of 10

sure, you can call it ugly if you really want, but i dont understand how it isnt pb2 styled. i dont see how it being very fast is a bad thing either. and half of the guns share sounds with other guns.
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